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Everything 12 strings (acoustic)

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  • Everything 12 strings (acoustic)

    A surprisingly great variety of threads in the acoustic section are started by members seeking info on their 12string guitars. Some of these instruments were pulled out of attics where they were dusting away, some were being kept for playing all these years.
    Flattop guitars with a bigger soundboard than the basic parlor models ("Wandergitarren") were present at Framus since the 1950s. Floating bridges, elevated fretboards, cutaways, weird adjustable saddles - they show signs of European archtop making tradition. By the early 60s, they became more standardized, in an American way. Just in time for a big demand due to discovery of blues, American folk and country music around the world.

    Klicke auf die Grafik für eine vergrößerte Ansicht

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    these models first were produced late in 1963
    [pic?]
    The model on the left on the leaflet page is 5/019 "Camping King"
    (spruce top, maple back and sides, sound hole surrounded by 9ply/ presumably celluloid binding)[link]
    on the right 5/024 "Hootenanny"(spruce top, mahogany back and sides, wooden purfling around sound hole, "sortierte Resonanzdecke" i.e. more even grain to the spruce top, giving the opportunity to offer natural finish, which isn't listed in this leaflet yet) https://www.framus-vintage.de/5-024-...24-Hootenanny/
    Have you seen the jumbo model. anywhere on the internet, or in real life? I haven't. (Off course there are examples in the later styles but here we are looking at the first years, 1963-65
    But there is proof of https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...ootnanny-5-099 5/099 : according to the list at framus-vintage.com, this dreadnought-shaped but not very big guitar is called "Folkmeister" - there is no listed picture or description)

    Each model has its 6-String counterpart. Model numbers are for example 5/95, 5/96, 5/98

    ###############################################
    │speculations box:

    │I recently saw a listing for a guitar marked 5/19-12, dating from August of 1963
    │it implies that these small bodied 12strings first were patternd after the Spanish variety, (5/19 is called "Ideal", or "Carmen" – as 5/28 is as well)

    You can see a "5/028" portrayed in a youtube video. 5/28 differing only slightly from 5/19: more nicely figured maple back and sides
    Now guess what 5/24 "Barcelona" in mid 60s specs looks like. (the blonde top, that is highly sought after in 5/024 for some reason)

    │Having a look inside we see that these guitars are all fan braced,. Are the 6string Western models as well? Any info or comments are welcome!The 12-strings off course having a sturdier neck block than the "Spanish", classical variety).
    ################################################


    Looking closely at the leaflet page, we see that Camping King started out with neck/body joint at 12th fret and slotted headstock, as documented by member Mono https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...of-manufacture ; member keef giving additional info (November 1963 being first month of production)
    and

    5/019, 12fret neck (plain rosette, slotted headstock) https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...?p=335#post335 posted by member Roxx Hunter.
    In 1964 headstocks became solid. Neck/body joint moved to the 14th fret early in 1965. Soundhole binding reduced to a two ply celuloid ring.


    Are there natural topped Camping Kings? Yes, there are: Klicke auf die Grafik für eine vergrößerte Ansicht

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    (pic posted by member aaronthearcher) guitar built December 1964.


    The Camping King's original floating bridge/tailpiece setup was first changed to a fixed, moustache shaped bridge (around November 1965), https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...-string-guitar
    Klicke auf die Grafik für eine vergrößerte Ansicht

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ID: 2025 then shortly thereafter (December) to a more standard type acoustic belly bridge, but with two 'points' at the back. At that time the fingerboard of these guitars became dots, as opposed to the earlier models.
    https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru.../422-12-string; posted by member larseb (amplified"Camping King", 5/019E dot markers on fretboard, pin bridge)

    https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...string#post776 ("Hootenanny" in sunburst, left handed, 14fret neck: spring of 1965 according to keef) I wonder if the slim pickup was factory fitted.
    Here's another, earlier one, pickup removed: https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...ember manc1973

    I might be interested in buying one of those, a project guitar for fixing up would do and fit my budget best – or trading for a 6string acoustic. You can drop me a line: framus[at]resonanzen-owl[dot]de
    Angehängte Dateien

  • #2
    Things were becoming a bit hectic, weren't they? Late in 1965 another model (number) was introduced: 5/296, the "Texan". Keeping the rounded small body, with set neck made of scarf jointed mahogany, soon the multilaminate neck emerged, later or parallel the larger, dreadnaught shape.

    Klicke auf die Grafik für eine vergrößerte Ansicht

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ID: 2027 small bodied 5/296, still a set neck, made from beech ply

    Other changes were made to the bridge: height adjustable saddle and ultimately string anchor bolt-on design (date stamp info and good pictures are hard to obtain and/or keep, very sorry!)

    Bottom line: a Texan is a Texan is a Texan!

    The 6string version was posted by Member bremsnix: https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...s/1522-baujahr

    Caleb at Rosa String Works doing work on a guitar from this "transitional" period. It is actually a 5/299 model, very fancy with ebony bits and a back that may be Zebrano: you can see the X-bracing used then https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICpatnXts8s

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    • #3
      eventually, the neck became bolted on.

      https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...fy-this-guitar posted by member Joseph (5/296 "Texan 12", early example, headstock natural finish with ornament)

      https://forum.framus-vintage.de/foru...exan-12-string posted by member Norlander (5/296 "Texan 12", headstock finished in black, 1969)

      let's not forget the ugly sibling: same body, neck and bridge (may be the plastic one,which at some point was used on the fancier models as well I think) but just a dark ring painted on on the rim of its soundhole. That's "Dix". But to quote somebody on the internet: "my Dix is a better sounding twelvestring than my Texan".

      An analysis of the model is : here (acoustics section of this forum)

      it took nearly 8 years before the next major change happened, back to solid wood necks (glued in) and pin bridges.

      Klicke auf die Grafik für eine vergrößerte Ansicht  Name: 12memento1976.jpg Ansichten: 103 Größe: 135,4 KB ID: 2030

      (one of the later guitars from the Texan series, 1976)
      Angehängte Dateien
      Zuletzt geändert von Fee K.; 22.02.2024, 13:35.

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      • #4
        Hi there, i picked thus framus drin my fathers basement, what so you think.lg Peter

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        • #5
          Hallo Peter,

          der "Folkmeister" kommt zu Besuch!

          I mentioned the model quite early in the thread, including a link to a post by a French member, but didn't use his picture. Off courss the model deserves a post of its own, and you can provide it, if you like, with a picture of your guitar.
          Would be interesting to see if it has the modern style headstock yet and if the finish is braun schattiert (sunburst) or natural, and what the condition is. And what is the body width?
          Datestamp of March 1965 is surprisingly clear on this example.
          Thanks!

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          • #6
            Hier noch Bilder

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            • #7

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              • #8
                Sehr schön. Alles was man bei einem 65er Modell erwartet, allerdings auch Mahagoni-Korpus. Und ne Setlist! das "Extra-Schallloch" ist auch nicht soo schlimm.

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                • #9
                  So, neu besaitet, fertig.

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                  • #10
                    Sieht super aus. Ich bin ein bisschen neidisch.

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                    • #11
                      Can anyone tell me the name of the model of my 12 string I have had it since about 1973 (bought when I was 18 years old )
                      The model number looks to be 9097 but the first figure is not clear, the serial number is 16994 and the date stamp is 64D so I think it was built in April 1964

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                      • #12
                        Great! This confirms existence of the big 5/097 model (apart from on the catalogue page I posted above). It was called "Folk" or "Jumbo" back then. Does it have the "EX"-stamp on the label?

                        It doesn't look all that "jumbo" on the picture, so body width and length measurements would be interesting (also welcome from owners of the mid 60s 5/97 Jumbo 6-string, as I don't have that data for comparison!)

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